I guess this post will cause a minor explosion.
Hopefully not literally so.
So let me first state, that I understand the Israelis. After all, this is a country surrounded by nations committed to eradicating Israel. Not cool.
But I also understand the Palestinians. Innumerable of them have been displaced for generations and live under terrible circumstances.
There is no simple solution. Jews should have their home country and are entitled to living in peace and safety. So are Arabs.
We all watch the U.S. news.
That news is decidedly pro-Israel, more so than most of the other "Western" countries.
So, whatever you think, and I DON'T personally support what is being said in the following news clip, but I do think it helps us understand how "the other side" is thinking.
It is the kind of interview U.S. television wouldn't dare to show. And it's done by Ruper Murdoch's conservative U.K. Sky News.
And here a recent headline from Kuwait Times. Gives you an idea of how the Arab population get their news. Then again, just yesterday the New York Times had another terrible picture of a suffocated baby dug out of a house, with his mother's arm still clinging around him.
Awful, just awful.
23 comments:
Doc, Doc, Doc. Isn’t this getting to be a sad state of affairs?
First, let me take off my sweet little Christian lady hat and put on my offshore sailor hat.
Who is this, um, I want to call him a really crude term usually reserved for the above-mentioned sailors. Um. Ok, I just can’t say it.
Who is this d**che bag? I was insulted by the time the second sentence came out of his mouth. I don’t know who he is, maybe someone else can tell me.
Ok, I just had to know who his guy was. I had a whole rant all prepared. Then I Googled him.
This is who he is:
http://www.thisislondon.com/showbiz/celebbb/articles/21499605?source=Metro&ct=5
And this:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1679428/posts
Saved the best for last:
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article8869.htm
This is how I view all terrorists. They’re a rude bunch, combative, condescending (especially to women), and angry. I know they’re all wackadoos, but there is something really wrong with this guy.
I sure hope the links I’ve provided head off anyone actually trying to plead this guys case (but I doubt it will). I try really hard not take to heart anything a grown lunatic in a red leotard has to say.
I’m so glad I Googled first. Saved me a lot of typing….
Ok, so I read your post again, Doc. The video sidetracked me and I believe I missed your point. The point is propaganda.
I’m going to post two links (forgive me, I don’t know how to make them live). WARNING: the images are not for the squeamish. They are tragic and hard to look at.
As you know, the fake Reuters photos have set the blog world on fire. That’s old news by now. What isn’t old news is what’s coming out of the blog world now; evidence that many, MANY of the photos coming out of Lebanon have been staged. These people are actually dragging the bodies of dead children from place to place, staging photo ops. I won’t go into it, check it out for yourselves.
But like I said, be warned, the images are difficult to stomach.
http://eureferendum.blogspot.com/2006/08/qana-directors-cut.html
http://eureferendum.blogspot.com/2006/08/lights-camera-action.html
So my whole point is, everything I read is suspect. Everything I hear is suspect. Everything I see is suspect. If one does not get one’s “news” from as many diverse sources as possible, then one runs the risk of being duped and being sucked into the propaganda of one side or the other.
If you are only getting your information from one source, or from many sources who only show one side’s story, well then you’re liable to be shown as a sucker when all the smoke clears and the truth comes out.
Doc, you said:
"That news (US) is decidedly pro-Israel, more so than most of the other "Western" countries."
Interesting observation. I am of the opinion that our news sources are are definitely not pro Israel. I’m not saying they’ve supported Hezbollah’s position, but they’re gone out of their way to make Israel appear as the aggressors. It’s usually very subtle, the way they word their headlines, the captions for their photos etc. It’s all in the wording. I’m a word girl, I tend to notice when I’m being sold snake oil.
These were the headlines some time last week. I cut and pasted them directly from HuffPo when we were all commenting on “The Dead Baby” post.
MIDEAST CRISIS TICKER:
Iraqi VP: Israel Is Carrying Out “Massacres”…
Jerusalem Post: US Interested In Israeli Attack On Syria…
Tens Of Thousands Attempted Escape During Air Strike Halt…
Israel Declares 48-Hour Suspension Of Air strikes…
Israeli Strikes Kill Dozens In “Deadliest Single Attack”...
At Least 34 Children Among Dead In Qana…
Rice Abruptly Ends Mideast Trip In Wake Of Attack…
Lebanese Protesters Break Into Beirut UN Headquarters…
Don’t these headlines sound anti Israel, or at the very least, make Israel sound like barbarians? And these were the actual headlines of the leading new organizations.
But I would have to agree with you Doc, our news would naturally be more pro-Israel than the rest of the world. Israel is hated by all Arabs nations only slightly more than we are.
justanotheryblogreader,
If you would pull your head out of wherever you lost it,
"If Jews all gather in Israel, it will save us the trouble of going after them worldwide." (NY Times, May 23, 2004, p. 15, section 2, column 1.) Nasrallah is one of the most admired men in the Muslim and Arab world today. Hitler made similar threats in Mein Kampf but they were largely ignored. Nasrallah has a reputation for keeping his promises.
justanotheryblogreader said"
http://www.chomsky.info/whatsnew.htm
Now I'm convinced since chomsky is known as a bi-partisan neutral observer.
Finkelstein's hatred of Jews runs so deep that he has actually implied that his own mother, who survived the Nazi Holocaust, may have collaborated with the Nazis. If so, collaboration with evil seems to run in the family, because Finkelstein has clearly become a collaborator with Hezbollah anti-Semitism and Nazism. Finkelstein's website is filled with Hezbollah promotion, including breathless reprints of Nasrallah speeches."NOAM CHOMSKY," who works closely with Finkelstein, has said of Finkelstein that he is "a person who can speak with more authority and insight on these topics [Israel and anti-Semitism] than anyone I can think of."
The Iran-Hezbollah axis is the greatest threat to world peace, to Jewish survival, to western values, and to civilization. Those like Finkelstein, who support Hezbollah, and even those who refuse to fight against this evil, are on the wrong side of history. They are collaborators with Islamo-fascists--today's version of Nazism.
Doc, I see you've got your own crop of neo-con trolls here.
Doc, I see you've got your own crop of neo-con trolls here.
While I abhor the death and destruction I would still ask those attacking Israel how they should have responded to the murder and kidnapping of their soldiers by Hezbollah terrorists who came across the border specifically for this reason. NOT just to murder and kidnap but to set this off in the hopes or creating further hatred towards Israel.
So what should have Israel done? Tell their citizens that their government could care less if Jew hating Muslims kill them they won't respond because they don't want to get anyone in the Mid East mad at them?
Fight for their survival and tell those who step into their country for harmful reasons the retailation will be large and painful?
What would you have them do?
They are not just fighting for their soldiers but for their entire population. The muslim world has made no secret of it's desire to wipe Israel off the face of the world and to hunt down and kill every Jew they can.
So exactly what is Israel to do?
Act like they did when Hitler came for them and lie down and die?
I support Israel completely in this matter as they are indeed under attack and fighting for their very survival as a race.
And I am a proud liberal in this country who as well feels the MSM is NOT pro Israel.
JABR asks:
"Is there something patently wrong with those headlines if they are true. How would you word them?"
Glad you asked. How about not using the word "attack" in every other sentence? Last time I checked, Israel was "attacked" first. And the use of the word "massacres" was just repugnant.
Main Entry: mas·sa·cre
Pronunciation: 'ma-si-k&r
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle French
1 : the act or an instance of killing a number of usually helpless or unresisting human beings under circumstances of atrocity or cruelty
2 : a cruel or wanton murder
This was neither an atrocity, nor cruel, nor murder. By using the word massacre, the message is that Israel is nothing but a demonic killer. Rwanda was a massacre. Auschwitz was a massacre. Even New Orleans was a massacre. This is not wanton murder. This is a war.
By the way, that headline was a quote from the Iraqi VP. Since when do we listen to him? Talk about biting the hand feeds you.
You asked if I knew what it was like to be displaced. No I don’t. But then again, I don’t know what it’s like to trade recipes with a terrorist over my backyard fence either.
BOTTOM LINE BOTTOM LINE BOTTOM LINE!
Israel was ATTACKED first (the proper use of the word). The Lebanese people embrace the ATTACKERS (see how easy it is to use words correctly?). The Lebanese people will most likely suffer the same fate as the ATTACKERS.
And for those of you who are still "mourning" the 34 deaths in Qana, wake up and smell the propaganda. The LEBANESE doctor who handled the casualties of that "attack" said there weren’t 34, THERE WERE 14. No screaming headlines for that little tidbit of information.
Obviously the old saying is true, the first casualty of any war is the truth.
But it’s so hard to demonize with a lower death count…
I’ll not debate the right or wrong of this war anymore. No weapon is strong enough to pierce your fact-deflecting armor (as Shooter so aptly calls it). So let’s don’t turn this thread into yet another "Israel is mean and Hezbollah is just plain groovy" debate. I’ve moved on. The war is here. Hezbollah started it. Lebanese will die because they support Hezbollah.
The more intriguing subject matter now is the spin. But I guess if you can’t see it, you won’t have much to say about the matter.
And Rose, you can ask that question til your fingers bleed. None of the commenters here will EVER give you an answer. They all just want to whine about how evil Israel is.
How about it? Will any of you anti-Israel commenters answer her? You wouldn’t last week when I posed the same question (several times).
Just a couple of facts.
The two Israeli soldier kinapping incident was preceeded by kidnappings of two Lebanese civilians (one doctor and one politician's son) a week before by the Israeli IDF. We wont even get into how many Lebanese soldiers have been kidnapped from Lebanon because the actual # is fucking ridiculous. It's be like trying to compare Israeli civilian casualties to Palestinian civilian casualties in the Infantada without using the 1 Israeli life equals 1000 Palestinian lives ratio all you crazy apologists seem to believe.
This invasion is a replay - with similar bullshit reasons - of 1982 when Israel went in and massacred civilians much to the dismay of all countries not owned by AIPAC.
What they learned from that incident was not that it was horrible to kill so many civilians in their land grab attempt, it was that they didn't have enough control over the press here and they would need to start buying out PR firms so they could spin better the policy of murder for land.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7828123714384920696&q=peace+propaganda
They are killing anyone in South Lebonon, be they Muslims, Christians, Canadians, Journalists, Women, Children, or Seniors.
“The pattern of attacks shows the Israeli military’s disturbing disregard for the lives of Lebanese civilians,” said Kenneth Roth, executive director of Human Rights Watch, in a prepared statement.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJutvtygz8k&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwakeupfromyourslumber%2Eblogspot%2Ecom%2F2006%2F07%2Fisraels%2Dfinal%2Dsolution%2Dto%2Darabs%2Din%2Ehtml
To anyone trying to defend Israel's policies to intelligent discerning people, you either sound crazy or evil. I'll let you pick.
Also, for you supposed Americans who continue to defend Israel's insane policies, I have two things for you to google and respond back: Rachel Corrie and the U.S.S. Liberty. Any of you "patriots" wanna take a stab?
Moo, Rose....Why? Why do you keep banging your heads into the "alternate universe?" Is there one, just one Republican who's mind has been changed rgarding the repulsive assault on Bill Clinton and our sanity? "HE LIED UNDER OATH!!!!!!!" A penny for the billions of times the drones followed Rove's orders to spout that puke would make you the richest person on earth. And a penny for each URL these truth/logic/morality deniers have at their fingertips will get you the pentouse at Willowbrook State Psychiatric Center. They have drunk the kool-aid. They walk, they talk, if only they could think.............neo-con troll.....LOL
Anon,
I’ll see your U.S.S. Liberty and raise you 241 dead marines.
http://www.arlingtoncemetery.net/terror.htm
You know, I wonder. And I know NONE of you would ever admit it. But I wonder just how many of you anti-Israel folks were jumping up and down with excitement and frothing at the mouth the night we invaded Iraq. Oh I know, not you , not you. But you know who you are.
And I wonder. Why are we the only ones who get to defend themselves against terrorists? Where do you get off telling another country that they can’t do the same? Or is it just Israel you have a problem. Anyone called YOU an anti-Semite lately?
How utterly arrogant of you.
And Shooter, I know….the neo-con troll comment cracked me up too. God if they only knew….
Ok, I will now back away from the keyboard...
Beeta asks,
"How can one reconcile this quandry?"
Um, don't watch MSM? Look for the button on the remote that says "off". It should be right below the one that says "on". Now just push it.
I find this proceedure has worked for me in the past.
Wasn't Rachel Corrie the Moonbat that mistook the 280mm cannons on the U.S.S.Liberty for Osama's pecker and got blown to hell?
You Anon..
Go back and get your GED before coming on here and shooting your mouth off with your cut and paste new learned skills. You may come from a site where a flatline is normal, but most of us here have moved beyond "oh, yeah, what about this? and what about this? yeah,yeah so there! you're boring. Go to sleep.
Thanks Beeta, I'll try this.
I only hope the sites have lots of pictures.
And just for the record, some of us got our edu-ma-cations before Wikipedia was invented.
No mas, Moo. Every time I think I hit a homer and start struttin, I get the Moo boomerang in my skull. You have found your wings, baby. I am in awe.
I better get some sleep. This blog has stepped it up a notch tonite. Gonna be tougher stayin on top.
yeah I know, gonna have to start paying attention eh?
PS, You have the utmost struttin' rights. I'm sure that's not correct grammar but hey, it's late an we're the only ones still awake.
As usual...
Beeta, I can't believe it! It was in you all the time. Let it out kid, you're doing great!
As for Moo, if I am Kal-el, she is Jor-el.
Look it up.
Shooter,
Kal-el and Jor-el? Woooooow. That whooshing noise is the sound of that reference going right over my head. I’m not the least bit embarrassed to admit I had to look it up! Dear God man, is there end to the depth of the crevasses of your imagination? I stand in awe.
And just for the record, you have it backwards. I think the reference alone proves that I, indeed, would be Kal-el.
And now for Beeta. Ok that’s it! You and me, mud wrestling, 4:00 o’clock. Be There!
Just for shooter:
iraq-war.ru and uruknet.info
Enjoy!
Hey thanks anon, but I got enough problems with deer ticks up here, sand fleas are gonna have to wait. So when will the half million guys realize they're "permanently disabled?"
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